photoshop style layering

[John Alexander-7]

Hi group,

I'm making a figure and I realize that I use imageJ for
everything except for assembling the final figure layout.  
That's because imageJ does not have an easy layer style
approach to moving objects around on an image.

For example, in photoshop, I can paste an image down, and
position it.  I can then paste a second image down and
position it.  It is easy to switch between the first and
second images, and adjust their positions accordingly.  This
goes on and on - and ultimately I have a PSD file with dozens
of layers that I can easily move around.

In imageJ, once I paste something, I can move it around, but,
when I'm done it's position is set in stone.

I realize that imageJ does have the components to act like
photoshop - in essence, a multi-layer tiff as the layers and
a z-projection as the final image.  What would be needed is a
"layer view" and a "z-projection view" in parallel.  with an
easy way to "add layer" and to move layers around.

does anyone know of a simple way of accomplishing this in
imageJ?  I'd really prefer to use it for all my needs.

John

John Alexander, Ph.D.
Post-doctoral Fellow
William Green Lab
University of Chicago
947 E. 58th St.
Abott Hall 402
Chicago, IL 60637
off: [phone]
fax: [phone]
[hidden email]

[dscho]

Hi,

On Wed, 13 May 2009, John Alexander wrote:

> I'm making a figure and I realize that I use imageJ for everything
> except for assembling the final figure layout.  That's because imageJ
> does not have an easy layer style approach to moving objects around on
> an image.
>
> For example, in photoshop, I can paste an image down, and position it.  
> I can then paste a second image down and position it.  It is easy to
> switch between the first and second images, and adjust their positions
> accordingly.  This goes on and on - and ultimately I have a PSD file
> with dozens of layers that I can easily move around.
>
> In imageJ, once I paste something, I can move it around, but, when I'm
> done it's position is set in stone.
>
> I realize that imageJ does have the components to act like photoshop -
> in essence, a multi-layer tiff as the layers and a z-projection as the
> final image.  What would be needed is a "layer view" and a "z-projection
> view" in parallel.  with an easy way to "add layer" and to move layers
> around.
>
> does anyone know of a simple way of accomplishing this in imageJ?  I'd
> really prefer to use it for all my needs.

You can (ab)use TrakEM2 for that...

Ciao,
Dscho

[Justin McGrath-2]

Since ImageJ is an image analysis program and not an image editing program,
I don't think it works well for creating figures.  If you want something
roughly along the lines of Photoshop without the hefty price tag, The GIMP
is suitable.

Justin

On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 11:24 AM, Johannes Schindelin <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Wed, 13 May 2009, John Alexander wrote:
>
> > I'm making a figure and I realize that I use imageJ for everything
> > except for assembling the final figure layout.  That's because imageJ
> > does not have an easy layer style approach to moving objects around on
> > an image.
> >
> > For example, in photoshop, I can paste an image down, and position it.
> > I can then paste a second image down and position it.  It is easy to
> > switch between the first and second images, and adjust their positions
> > accordingly.  This goes on and on - and ultimately I have a PSD file
> > with dozens of layers that I can easily move around.
> >
> > In imageJ, once I paste something, I can move it around, but, when I'm
> > done it's position is set in stone.
> >
> > I realize that imageJ does have the components to act like photoshop -
> > in essence, a multi-layer tiff as the layers and a z-projection as the
> > final image.  What would be needed is a "layer view" and a "z-projection
> > view" in parallel.  with an easy way to "add layer" and to move layers
> > around.
> >
> > does anyone know of a simple way of accomplishing this in imageJ?  I'd
> > really prefer to use it for all my needs.
>
> You can (ab)use TrakEM2 for that...
>
> Ciao,
> Dscho
>

[Glen MacDonald-2]

Adobe Elements is a fraction of the price for Photoshop and provides  
the important components for scientific use, like layers and adjusting  
the levels.

Glen
Glen MacDonald
Core for Communication Research
Virginia Merrill Bloedel Hearing Research Center
Box 357923
University of Washington
Seattle, WA 98195-7923  USA
[phone]
[hidden email]

******************************************************************************
The box said "Requires WindowsXP or better", so I bought a Macintosh.
******************************************************************************


On May 13, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Justin McGrath wrote:

> Since ImageJ is an image analysis program and not an image editing  
> program,
> I don't think it works well for creating figures.  If you want  
> something
> roughly along the lines of Photoshop without the hefty price tag,  
> The GIMP
> is suitable.
>
> Justin
>
> On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 11:24 AM, Johannes Schindelin <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> On Wed, 13 May 2009, John Alexander wrote:
>>
>>> I'm making a figure and I realize that I use imageJ for everything
>>> except for assembling the final figure layout.  That's because  
>>> imageJ
>>> does not have an easy layer style approach to moving objects  
>>> around on
>>> an image.
>>>
>>> For example, in photoshop, I can paste an image down, and position  
>>> it.
>>> I can then paste a second image down and position it.  It is easy to
>>> switch between the first and second images, and adjust their  
>>> positions
>>> accordingly.  This goes on and on - and ultimately I have a PSD file
>>> with dozens of layers that I can easily move around.
>>>
>>> In imageJ, once I paste something, I can move it around, but, when  
>>> I'm
>>> done it's position is set in stone.
>>>
>>> I realize that imageJ does have the components to act like  
>>> photoshop -
>>> in essence, a multi-layer tiff as the layers and a z-projection as  
>>> the
>>> final image.  What would be needed is a "layer view" and a "z-
>>> projection
>>> view" in parallel.  with an easy way to "add layer" and to move  
>>> layers
>>> around.
>>>
>>> does anyone know of a simple way of accomplishing this in imageJ?  
>>> I'd
>>> really prefer to use it for all my needs.
>>
>> You can (ab)use TrakEM2 for that...
>>
>> Ciao,
>> Dscho
>>

[Jonathan Hilmer]

Gimp will work, but for figures (or posters), a vector graphics
package is the far better solution.  I prefer Inkscape, due to the
simplicity and cost (free).

The final post in the following discussion has a good overview with
screenshots showing how Inkscape can be used to make posters, but
there's no real difference when making figures.
http://inkscape-forum.andreas-s.net/topic/146897

Here are some of the screenshots:
http://jo.irisson.free.fr/dropbox/inkscape/poster_inkscape_style2.png
http://jo.irisson.free.fr/dropbox/inkscape/poster_inkscape_outline.png

The best part of using Inkscape is that it's totally
resolution-independent, so you can export graphics for publication at
whatever resolution or format is required.  Of course any bitmap
images you have embedded within Inkscape will just be resampled, so
it's best to start out with good resolution images.

There are only two disadvantages to Inkscape that I have found so far.
 First, the PDF export option works fine but treats text as shapes, so
the resulting files are huge if there is substantial amounts of text:
~500MB for a poster with about 50% text.  Second, it doesn't embed
images within the saved files the way Powerpoint does: it just saves
links in the manner of OpenOffice.  I rather prefer that behavior, but
you have to be prepared for it if you're moving files around.


Jonathan


On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:02 PM, Glen MacDonald
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Adobe Elements is a fraction of the price for Photoshop and provides the
> important components for scientific use, like layers and adjusting the
> levels.
>
> Glen
> Glen MacDonald
> Core for Communication Research
> Virginia Merrill Bloedel Hearing Research Center
> Box 357923
> University of Washington
> Seattle, WA 98195-7923  USA
> [phone]
> [hidden email]
>
> ******************************************************************************
> The box said "Requires WindowsXP or better", so I bought a Macintosh.
> ******************************************************************************
>
>
> On May 13, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Justin McGrath wrote:
>
>> Since ImageJ is an image analysis program and not an image editing
>> program,
>> I don't think it works well for creating figures.  If you want something
>> roughly along the lines of Photoshop without the hefty price tag, The GIMP
>> is suitable.
>>
>> Justin
>>
>> On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 11:24 AM, Johannes Schindelin <
>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> On Wed, 13 May 2009, John Alexander wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm making a figure and I realize that I use imageJ for everything
>>>> except for assembling the final figure layout.  That's because imageJ
>>>> does not have an easy layer style approach to moving objects around on
>>>> an image.
>>>>
>>>> For example, in photoshop, I can paste an image down, and position it.
>>>> I can then paste a second image down and position it.  It is easy to
>>>> switch between the first and second images, and adjust their positions
>>>> accordingly.  This goes on and on - and ultimately I have a PSD file
>>>> with dozens of layers that I can easily move around.
>>>>
>>>> In imageJ, once I paste something, I can move it around, but, when I'm
>>>> done it's position is set in stone.
>>>>
>>>> I realize that imageJ does have the components to act like photoshop -
>>>> in essence, a multi-layer tiff as the layers and a z-projection as the
>>>> final image.  What would be needed is a "layer view" and a "z-projection
>>>> view" in parallel.  with an easy way to "add layer" and to move layers
>>>> around.
>>>>
>>>> does anyone know of a simple way of accomplishing this in imageJ?  I'd
>>>> really prefer to use it for all my needs.
>>>
>>> You can (ab)use TrakEM2 for that...
>>>
>>> Ciao,
>>> Dscho
>>>
>

[Philip Ershler]

Absolutely, without doubt ImageJ is a great tool. But just as one  
wouldn't use a hacksaw to drive nails or a hammer to cut lumber,  
ImageJ has never even pretended to be a layout program. Even though  
there are some features that Photoshop and ImageJ share, they are as  
different as a hacksaw and a hammer. Always use the right tool for the  
job.

Phil

On May 13, 2009, at 4:36 PM, Justin McGrath wrote:

> Since ImageJ is an image analysis program and not an image editing  
> program,
> I don't think it works well for creating figures.  If you want  
> something
> roughly along the lines of Photoshop without the hefty price tag,  
> The GIMP
> is suitable.
>
> Justin
>
> On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 11:24 AM, Johannes Schindelin <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> On Wed, 13 May 2009, John Alexander wrote:
>>
>>> I'm making a figure and I realize that I use imageJ for everything
>>> except for assembling the final figure layout.  That's because  
>>> imageJ
>>> does not have an easy layer style approach to moving objects  
>>> around on
>>> an image.
>>>
>>> For example, in photoshop, I can paste an image down, and position  
>>> it.
>>> I can then paste a second image down and position it.  It is easy to
>>> switch between the first and second images, and adjust their  
>>> positions
>>> accordingly.  This goes on and on - and ultimately I have a PSD file
>>> with dozens of layers that I can easily move around.
>>>
>>> In imageJ, once I paste something, I can move it around, but, when  
>>> I'm
>>> done it's position is set in stone.
>>>
>>> I realize that imageJ does have the components to act like  
>>> photoshop -
>>> in essence, a multi-layer tiff as the layers and a z-projection as  
>>> the
>>> final image.  What would be needed is a "layer view" and a "z-
>>> projection
>>> view" in parallel.  with an easy way to "add layer" and to move  
>>> layers
>>> around.
>>>
>>> does anyone know of a simple way of accomplishing this in imageJ?  
>>> I'd
>>> really prefer to use it for all my needs.
>>
>> You can (ab)use TrakEM2 for that...
>>
>> Ciao,
>> Dscho
>>

[drix]

Hi Jonathan,

For a poster I would recommand Scribus over Inkscape. It is a program
make for page layout so the text is treated as text and image as
image.

Regards,
Hendrix

On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 7:15 PM, Jonathan Hilmer <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Gimp will work, but for figures (or posters), a vector graphics
> package is the far better solution.  I prefer Inkscape, due to the
> simplicity and cost (free).
>
> The final post in the following discussion has a good overview with
> screenshots showing how Inkscape can be used to make posters, but
> there's no real difference when making figures.
> http://inkscape-forum.andreas-s.net/topic/146897
>
> Here are some of the screenshots:
> http://jo.irisson.free.fr/dropbox/inkscape/poster_inkscape_style2.png
> http://jo.irisson.free.fr/dropbox/inkscape/poster_inkscape_outline.png
>
> The best part of using Inkscape is that it's totally
> resolution-independent, so you can export graphics for publication at
> whatever resolution or format is required.  Of course any bitmap
> images you have embedded within Inkscape will just be resampled, so
> it's best to start out with good resolution images.
>
> There are only two disadvantages to Inkscape that I have found so far.
>  First, the PDF export option works fine but treats text as shapes, so
> the resulting files are huge if there is substantial amounts of text:
> ~500MB for a poster with about 50% text.  Second, it doesn't embed
> images within the saved files the way Powerpoint does: it just saves
> links in the manner of OpenOffice.  I rather prefer that behavior, but
> you have to be prepared for it if you're moving files around.
>
>
> Jonathan
>
>
> On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 5:02 PM, Glen MacDonald
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Adobe Elements is a fraction of the price for Photoshop and provides the
>> important components for scientific use, like layers and adjusting the
>> levels.
>>
>> Glen
>> Glen MacDonald
>> Core for Communication Research
>> Virginia Merrill Bloedel Hearing Research Center
>> Box 357923
>> University of Washington
>> Seattle, WA 98195-7923  USA
>> [phone]
>> [hidden email]
>>
>> ******************************************************************************
>> The box said "Requires WindowsXP or better", so I bought a Macintosh.
>> ******************************************************************************
>>
>>
>> On May 13, 2009, at 3:36 PM, Justin McGrath wrote:
>>
>>> Since ImageJ is an image analysis program and not an image editing
>>> program,
>>> I don't think it works well for creating figures.  If you want something
>>> roughly along the lines of Photoshop without the hefty price tag, The GIMP
>>> is suitable.
>>>
>>> Justin
>>>
>>> On Wed, May 13, 2009 at 11:24 AM, Johannes Schindelin <
>>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, 13 May 2009, John Alexander wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I'm making a figure and I realize that I use imageJ for everything
>>>>> except for assembling the final figure layout.  That's because imageJ
>>>>> does not have an easy layer style approach to moving objects around on
>>>>> an image.
>>>>>
>>>>> For example, in photoshop, I can paste an image down, and position it.
>>>>> I can then paste a second image down and position it.  It is easy to
>>>>> switch between the first and second images, and adjust their positions
>>>>> accordingly.  This goes on and on - and ultimately I have a PSD file
>>>>> with dozens of layers that I can easily move around.
>>>>>
>>>>> In imageJ, once I paste something, I can move it around, but, when I'm
>>>>> done it's position is set in stone.
>>>>>
>>>>> I realize that imageJ does have the components to act like photoshop -
>>>>> in essence, a multi-layer tiff as the layers and a z-projection as the
>>>>> final image.  What would be needed is a "layer view" and a "z-projection
>>>>> view" in parallel.  with an easy way to "add layer" and to move layers
>>>>> around.
>>>>>
>>>>> does anyone know of a simple way of accomplishing this in imageJ?  I'd
>>>>> really prefer to use it for all my needs.
>>>>
>>>> You can (ab)use TrakEM2 for that...
>>>>
>>>> Ciao,
>>>> Dscho
>>>>
>>
>

[Robert Dougherty]

You might try my Layers plugin.

Bob

Robert Dougherty, Ph.D.
President, OptiNav, Inc.
4176 148th Ave. NE
Redmond, WA 98052
[phone]
FAX [phone]
www.optinav.com
[hidden email]